• Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Topic: Sussex Profit

It is nice to hear that Sussex made a profit, ableit it being only £1,455. But too be honest although the recession has been a big factor, I would have expected that figure to have been slightly larger. Espeically, with all our success in the one-day format and the Australia tour match I would have thought the club made quite a bit of money. I would like to know how much revenue we actually made within the year (and where from) and where it was spent or lost.
The profit we made, was before massive figures were taken away like the £100,000 cost of the indoor school refurbishment and of course we still will have to pay for the ground improvements, which are a tiny sum of £8 million. I am glad we made a profit though, which is better than most of the other counties.

Just want to hear your thoughts for reassurance as much as anything because I am slightly worried about that article.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • Registered: 26-04-2006
  • Posts: 601

Re: Sussex Profit

£1455 surplus on a £5,800,000 revenue would not give me a feeling of satisfaction

  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

dvlangford wrote:

£1455 surplus on a £5,800,000 revenue would not give me a feeling of satisfaction

Precisely what I thought and considering that 29% on last year even throughout a recession, is extremely worrying. Why would our costs be so high.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Hailsham
  • Registered: 12-05-2006
  • Posts: 5,049

Re: Sussex Profit

You have to take into account the previous years losses, so the trading turnaround is quite good.
I'm sure someone on here will be able to say what last years losses were.

Who is that man talking to Schlidd ?
  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

Yes, well I would like to know :S The future expenses does not look great but we will pull through somehow big_smile We must have some money somewhere in order to consider ground improvements, hopefully we have just put aside a couple of million for the ground.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Three Bridges
  • Registered: 06-09-2006
  • Posts: 4,870

Re: Sussex Profit

Money has been put somewhere for ground improvements, it's called the Spen Cama legacy   roll

Remember ?, it's the money that various messageboarders want used to pay the wages of new players ......

  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

That makes the future even more worrying because the article says that this figure was produced before we signed Monty and co. So where is alll the money going?

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Fishersgate Maritime Village
  • Registered: 04-11-2006
  • Posts: 10,444

Re: Sussex Profit

i must admit when they said a small profit, i wasnt expecting it to be pence! - but a good indicator of the clubs problems -  even in a successful year with extra income from the Aussie game we dont much of a profit - some of the extra success must have gone to the players, but believe part of problem was poor crowds for 20/20 early rounds and for the fp trophy.
Anyway it all just shows the importance of getting the ground development right, to increase our income without it being matched by corresponding increase in expenditure
At least we didnt make a loss, as we have for the last few years, some of which was due to some poor decision-making

  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

That is what Dave Brooks has put it down to, the 20/20 and fp trophy early matches, but it still amazes me that the club is working at a loss. We are relying on the Spen Cama money to keep the books balanced.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/cricket … 534259.stm

I am surprised at the generous lack of criticism concerning these figures. I am shocked by them. These results cover October 2008-October 2009, I presume? Therefore, they cover last season and shouldn't take into account any losses from the 2008 season.

Where has the money disappeared to? How can a county only make a paltry profit of £1,455 on a turnover of £5.8m. It beggars belief!

It's great Sussex have made a profit, I agree but, to repeat, where on earth has all the money gone?

Okay, there was a £100,000 refurbishment on the indoor school but did that not come from the Spen Cama legacy?

Quite frankly, members should start asking some awkward questions. While I applaud the county on attracting £5.8m, to then only make £1,455 profit... on this basis, many companies would sack their FD.

The ground refurbishment is totally separate and the £8.6m is coming from the Cama legacy. I find it amusing that Jim May blames a lower interest rate, which means they would have received less interest from this legacy but that is a separate issue and has little to do with the county's profit.

Players wages, management expenses..? Perhaps, we should ask that American journalist who blew the lid on the House of Commons expenses to investigate.  wink "Something is rotten in the state of Eaton Road."

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)
  • From: Fishersgate Maritime Village
  • Registered: 04-11-2006
  • Posts: 10,444

Re: Sussex Profit

so you fire a broadside with implied snidey accusations, based on very little instead, S & F

  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

Soft and Fluffy that is just my point, something is not right. I am glad I am not the only one seeing a problem, £5.8 million spent in one season, how? Someones obviously making a bit of money.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

sweaty,

Your quote, "i must admit when they said a small profit, i wasnt expecting it to be pence! - but a good indicator of the clubs problems - "

I am agreeing with you. The club has a gaping financial hole problem. As members, shouldn't we be told where all this money has gone to? There may be a very rational and simple answer. But for the hierarchy to say, "We had a turnover of £5.8m and then made just £1,455 profit..." without explaining why. People are going to query this and quite rightly so.

Last edited by softandfluffy (24-02-2010 18:33:54)

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)
  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

I don't know how Dave Brooks and co. can sit there and be happy with this report, they are obviously hiding something.

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • Registered: 30-06-2008
  • Posts: 2,365

Re: Sussex Profit

"Where has the money disappeared to? How can a county only make a paltry profit of £1,455 on a turnover of £5.8m. It beggars belief!" - S&F

No, it doesnt. Warwickshire turnoved over £7.8 million in 2007 - and lost £892,000.

You cant critisise an organsiation who make a profit - after several years of heavy losses - until you know the detail which I am sure will be explained in the Year book and at the AGM. Well you can but, sorry, then its just a rant based on nothing.

There could be many reasons why the increase in income hasnt produced a greater profit:

-  increased player bonuses with one day success
-  increased travel and accomodation with the India trip
- costs of preparing for the development
- structural losses (if you lost 200k in 2008 ,200k of the increased income is eaten up by this)

etc..

Until you know the detail its grossly unfair to make disparaging comments.

The Kookaburra Man
  • From: United Kingdom
  • Registered: 27-08-2004
  • Posts: 3,447

Re: Sussex Profit

Well as members we get accounts and can go to the AGM .

All I do know is that the interest from Spen Cama has kept this club going for the last 3years and obviously with interest rates poor that has gone down considerably this last year.

Spen Cama wanted his money spent on the ground and I am happy with that but we wont have the interest on 10m anymore and will we make extra income from the
new  ground  improvements????

I have my doubts but then again I believe sincerely that 2020 cricket will kill off the game I know and in 10 years when we have franchises Hove will be flats.

Without Spens money we would be skint and Hove would be sold now.

I think wages have gone way up and we do employ a lot more back room people than we have done before. Everyone has an assistant .

I am glad we made a profit but I am very worried about our finances .  In 2009 we had a home game v Australia and of course the Ashes . In 2010 all the 2020's clash with the soccer WC and Bangladesh for a 1 dayer is hardly the same as 4 dayers v Crowies mob.

I fear another loss this year .

  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

kim,

I applaud Sussex for making a profit after many years of losses. I applaud them for a 29% increase in turnover to £5.8m. Great stuff. But when releasing today's news, shouldn't the county also explain where the money has gone?

Supporters and Members will question, just as we have on this BB, where the £5,798,545 has been spent? I am sure there is a good and rational answer. No doubt in 2007 Warwickshire supporters were told how the county lost £892,000 on a turnover of £7.8m. Just as Kent supporters know why their club is breaching heavy losses on an annual basis.

Mine are not disparaging comments. I am querying what many Sussex supporters are presently thinking. The club needs to be transparent and tell us where this money has gone. And hopefully, sooner rather than later, they will do so.

To repeat, I applaud the club on making a profit. But given all the success and extra revenues Sussex enjoyed last season, the future doesn't augur too well, if the club can only make a paltry profit during the really good times.

Something isn't right.

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)
  • Registered: 30-06-2008
  • Posts: 2,365

Re: Sussex Profit

No - we werent told what caused the £892,000. But we were sent the accounts which we could analyse if we wanted and it was all then explained at the AGm. Thats how it works.

The Kookaburra Man
  • Registered: 18-09-2008
  • Posts: 338

Re: Sussex Profit

I agree completely with S&F, well said that man big_smile

Murray Goodwin is my God.
  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

kim,

I believe this year's AGM is on March 30th, so I may well go along.

I found this on Sussex CCC website Re: today's news. Jim May speaking, "(we) regard the result as satisfactory in testing times for the economy, especially given reduced interest rates resulted in £286,000 less income against our cash balances than in the prior year."

To be fair, if the profit had come in at £287,455, that would have been a little better; although, the club are still relying heavily on the Cama legacy. When the majority is spent on the ground refurbishment, that particular interest income is gone.

My problem, perhaps, is I had no idea until recently, just how bad and what financial dire straits much of county cricket is in. If you asked the BBC business trouble-shooter Sir Gerry Robinson to take a look, I suspect he might have a heart-attack.

That is not a criticism against the Sussex hierarchy or any other county management; apart from a tiny elite, county cricket is a financial loss-maker and is kept alive by the ECB, the banks and the 'Sky' money. Unless radically over-hauled, little will change, where making a profit, however small, is seen as a fortunate aberration.

I am amazed that the 18 counties continue to survive financially. A great feat of endurance.

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)
  • From: The corridor of uncertainty
  • Registered: 27-04-2005
  • Posts: 3,717

Re: Sussex Profit

softandfluffy wrote:

kim,

I believe this year's AGM is on March 30th, so I may well go along.

I found this on Sussex CCC website Re: today's news. Jim May speaking, "(we) regard the result as satisfactory in testing times for the economy, especially given reduced interest rates resulted in £286,000 less income against our cash balances than in the prior year."

To be fair, if the profit had come in at £287,455, that would have been a little better; although, the club are still relying heavily on the Cama legacy. When the majority is spent on the ground refurbishment, that particular interest income is gone.

My problem, perhaps, is I had no idea until recently, just how bad and what financial dire straits much of county cricket is in. If you asked the BBC business trouble-shooter Sir Gerry Robinson to take a look, I suspect he might have a heart-attack.

That is not a criticism against the Sussex hierarchy or any other county management; apart from a tiny elite, county cricket is a financial loss-maker and is kept alive by the ECB, the banks and the 'Sky' money. Unless radically over-hauled, little will change, where making a profit, however small, is seen as a fortunate aberration.

I am amazed that the 18 counties continue to survive financially. A great feat of endurance.


Yes - thats more like it. The finances of county cricket are indeed amazing and Sussex are in a small minority of clubs that made a profit last year. Not only that they also won trophies on the pitch!

Those should be the headlines - if you want to see financial meltdown check out the books of Yorkshire, Kent and Hampshire. Next ask yourself these questions:

1. What is the likely future for the 18 counties?
2. How will the ones with massive debts to finance survive because first class cricket in this country is a loss making activity?
3. Am I pleased that Sussex have no debts, made a profit last season, have robbo in charge of cricket, have signed all our best players on long term contracts and last year won two trophies?

To become a Friend of the Sussex Cricket Museum and Educational Trust please text MONT07£10 to 70070 and send an email to jonfilby@blueyonder.co.uk
  • From: Fishersgate Maritime Village
  • Registered: 04-11-2006
  • Posts: 10,444

Re: Sussex Profit

On a lighter note, Ive just worked out that the Messageboard quiz nights are responsible for over 50% of the clubs profits!

  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

parsons,

Imagine watching a TV programme where Sir Gerry Robinson looks at county cricket. What financial horrors might he find? I would imagine many.

At Sussex, I suspect the overwhelming culprit is the high players and staff wages. Ever since they lead the county pack by paying Chris Adams, at that time, an absurdly large amount of wonga to be captain, it may have become a part of their financial culture.

Then buoyed by the championship successes during the noughties, wages might have risen even more. And not just Sussex but probably a majority of counties are in a similar predicament. It's why Derbyshire, I suspect, are able to achieve a profit year after year; because their players' salaries are a third of most other counties.

Does anyone know what the Sussex wage bill is? Does this appear in the 2008 accounts?

edit:

Ah, my googling has paid off. This sentence comes from a 'Guardian' article in September 2003.  "Sussex represent something of a role model for other clubs. They have the smallest playing staff (18), though their wage bill is one of the highest in the country."

As I suspected, 6 years on, it is almost certainly still part of the club's financial culture. And who began it all? Chris Adams.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2003/se … ddlesexccc

Last edited by softandfluffy (24-02-2010 21:01:10)

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)
  • From: Fishersgate Maritime Village
  • Registered: 04-11-2006
  • Posts: 10,444

Re: Sussex Profit

yes players wages, and the appearance of the dreaded agents, has clearly increased costs - but then we either want to be competitive with the other counties or be Derbyshire

i dont think the accounts show the wage bill specifically, s&f - i think it comes under a wider umbrella of cricket expenditure.

  • From: Hove
  • Registered: 04-12-2009
  • Posts: 2,424

Re: Sussex Profit

sweaty,

How convenient.

"Now the stumps have asked for pads!"
(Aussie radio commentator Kerry O'Keeffe as Rahul Dravid, bowled six times in seven innings during the present series, walks out to bat at the Adelaide Oval)